Aperture and Capture One

Discussions, questions, comments and suggestions regarding Capture One PRO, Capture One DB and Capture One Express 7.x

Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby Maczero » Wed Jul 09, 2014 11:36 am

That definitely works - the automator action is really useful.

Did you think about starting in Aperture (as the DAM) doing all the library work there and then exporting the cream of the crop to C1 for adjustment? I find that the Catapult plugin works well for this, although I dare say somebody better than I am with Applescript or Automator could come up with an alternative. You can then reimport into Aperture for sharing etc, but you have your best shots in your C1 catalogue as well. A bit of duplication, but memory is relatively cheap.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby jsmcpheeters » Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:42 pm

strobes wrote:
Using C1 and Aperture.
(1) Create Aperture "Hot" Folder using Automator.
(2) Import your RAW files from camera into C1.
(3) Adjust as needed in C1.
(4) Export variant to HOT folder.
(5) Open Aperture and catalogue or use your plug-ins as normal.
(6) Don't forget to backup RAW files that will now be kept by C1



That's helpful. I prefer to import SD cards using Image Capture to a mirrored RAID configuration into session folders which become projects in Aperture. I'm experimenting with different methods to edit/cull the photos. Either in Aperture and then import the best to C1 for advanced editing (haven't figured out a way to round trip this flow like I can do with Aperture to Lr5 and back) or, doing the culling and editing in C1 first and leaving only the selects output as 16 bit tif files in the same folder as the RAW masters and reimporting those back to the aperture project and using auto stacks to pair them up.

Since I use referenced libraries in Aperture, I'm thinking Aperture can handle a larger library than C1 can, as it's been mostly geared toward sessions and Catalogs is a relatively new thing. So treating an Aperture project as a C1 session for creating the edits and importing those edits back into Aperture for now as referenced files feels like it will migrate well to what might occur when Photos arrives and can read in the Aperture/iPhoto libraries already present.

Also, if C1's catalogs become more robust, it's pretty simple to combine C1 Session databases into a catalog, in the event I decide that is preferable to what might exist in an Aperture-less workflow.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby Shihan » Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:45 pm

What I recently noticed is that the watermarking isn't as good as in Aperture... at least at the moment.

My watermark png looks good but when applied to the images in an receipt the edges become really noisy. So the watermark on the resulting images look unclean, unsmooth. Strange thing is, that if I click on the watermark (for moving it) the edges are smoothed really nicely - as soon as mouse button is release the edges become harsh again.

Would be nice if the smoothing of edges (as during mouse click/hold) would stay on watermark.

Also cloning of output receipt seems not to be directly possible. If I click on "+" symbol to add a receipt the currently selected one isn't cloned as in aperture. I have to start from scratch and manually adjust the new receipt to match the previously selected one.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby jsmcpheeters » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:20 pm

After using C17 Pro extensively the past two weeks (I'm not new to C1 Pro, either), I am assessing the situation based on two main criteria: 1) The time and complexity in bringing RAW images from camera, selections, adjustments, and cataloging and 2) Maintaining highest image quality possible. After several attempts to try and beat the C17 Pro RAW output with Aperture and Lightroom, I'm more convinced than ever that I want to keep C17 Pro in the workflow. I'm also convinced it's not up to speed for selecting and cataloging when compared with Aperture. It's also somewhat more crash prone than Aperture. So here's my compromise for the next few weeks and I'll reassess sometime toward the end of summer.

I handle several photo sessions per week, often two or more per day, and each one with hundreds and occasionally, thousands, of images to select from and adjust and catalog.

Aperture, C17 Pro, and Lightroom 5 can all get bogged down as the image library grows, even using referenced images. A fast system with lots of ram and fast storage goes without saying, of course, but still, I work best with very responsive tools. so, with all of these, the initial part of my workflow involves treating them as 'session-only' editors. I don't bring the images into a larger catalog until I have whittled down the master files to just the few I want to keep. And from my experience and personal preferences, Aperture is hands down the better tool for importing/selecting/tagging(meta data) as well as final cataloging. I'm hoping that, for my own interests, Photos eventually will at least be as good at those four functions: import, selecting, tagging, and cataloging.

So here's the workflow I'm using that seems to keep things fairly smooth, assuming that at some point in the future, Aperture will be replaced with Photos/photokit built into the Mac OS as well as iOS, making cross platform mobile workflow a more seamless experience. Could be dreaming. We'll see.

1. RAW images imported with Image Capture to a mirrored RAID drive I call Work In Progress and backed up to archival drive simultaneously to a session folder labeled by yearmonthdate_sessionname.
2. Launch Capture One to create a new session of same name within the session folder to create the subfolder structure it likes to create, then quit.
2. Launch Aperture and create a New Library of same session name stored in that folder with the RAW images. Images imported as referenced images in the same place (or could be managed, really, wouldn't make much difference in this scenario)
3. Auto stacking images and manual stacking, then sorting through each stack for keepers - get 1 star - filtered to a smart album for one star or better. Export the selections as Originals to the appropriate C1 created by C1 in step 2.
4. Use C1 to make adjustments to the RAW files and export 16bit pro photo tiff files (I use the Output folder that C1 created.) Here is another weak spot with C1 in automation - in Lightroom its simple to create an export recipe to send these directly to Aperture to a particular project.
5. Launch Aperture and import the output tiffs to the session library. Now that library can be further worked on using Aperture, external editors, plugins, etc. and merged into a larger Library at some point when I'm satisfied the session is completed for the time being. I can also continue to rework the files in C1 if I decide to go a different direction - say B&W or a different crop arrangement, or for any reason that might present itself.

By the way, the ratings appear to stick in moving files between Aperture and C1, so that's useful to know. I can adjust ratings in C1 for example, to pick 2 and 3 stars to use as 'recommended' and 'favorites' and 4 or 5 stars for those that will be portfolio/gallery works and when they are exported as tiffs and Aperture imports them, those ratings follow.

Once I'm done, I generally throw away all the files I don't need. I have the original RAWs archived and I have the session library moved with referenced files to another mirrored RAID system with daily scheduled backups to multiple drives. Technically, if you wanted to save space and had the original RAW files archived, you could simple keep the 16bit tiffs in the Aperture Library and not worry about the original RAW files, though the tiffs are taking up the most space. If one is a heavy Photoshop user, they might choose to use PSD output vs TIFF.

For my advanced editing workflow, the best tiffs in Aperture will usually go to Photoshop with Topaz Labs/Nik plugins for final editing and archived off site via the Internet. For less important projects, family and recreational events, I can bypass the C1 steps entirely and I hope Photos will be sufficient enough to meet my needs, but if not, well, I like Snapseed on my iOS devices and I fully expect there to be many tools to choose from so I can turn 20 or 30 shots from a family reunion or friendly outing into something edited to my tastes.

If I were a session workflow photographer ONLY, and never had a use for a catalog/library that scaled larger over time, I'd have never left Capture One for Aperture back in '06. But I do need to work in some projects over time with slide shows, time lapse sequences, etc., and many thousands of images, and at this point, Aperture is still the best tool on a mac for that, and hopefully, Photos will replace it adequately when the time comes.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby CAPTURE NIKON D700 » Wed Jul 23, 2014 3:15 pm

i think some people hear trying to put the holly world in on place :D
there are different ways are showing hear how you joint 3 Programs in one together, but sorry this don’t makes since for me !
LR and AP or CP1 are programs includes with grade Databank Workflow and all downing good jobs,
if you don’t make know your decision which program you select you will not be able to find the end :lol:
after Apple said "no moor Develops for Aperture" i make my decision to go to CP1 :D
that’s way i bayed a license , after that i erased all other programs like Aperture, LR.... or-- completely from my I mac and said BAY BAY ...to them
know i can only concentrate of one workflow for Pictures in CP1 , and no moor authors , and waiting for such missing thinks or solutions in Cp1 are soon coming , i put my trust in Phase one developers because they are downing really good jobs in Cp1


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Camera : Nikon D700
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby spacecat » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:09 am

I wish I've seen this sooner... the voucher has now expired :(((
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby Paul_Steunebrink » Thu Jul 31, 2014 8:31 am

spacecat wrote:I wish I've seen this sooner... the voucher has now expired :(((

No need to be sad. You get the low price without voucher! :wink:
http://www.phaseone.com/en/Online-Store ... Pro-7.aspx
Best regards,
Paul E. Steunebrink, Image Alchemist (website All about Capture One), Capture One trainer
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby CopperBeechPhotography » Mon Aug 11, 2014 12:25 am

I have trialed C1 and have purchased it. i am now waiting for the easy transition process to come from the folks at C1. Hope it comes soon.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby apfelnase » Thu Aug 21, 2014 3:24 pm

Shihan wrote:What I recently noticed is that the watermarking isn't as good as in Aperture... at least at the moment.

My watermark png looks good but when applied to the images in an receipt the edges become really noisy. So the watermark on the resulting images look unclean, unsmooth. Strange thing is, that if I click on the watermark (for moving it) the edges are smoothed really nicely - as soon as mouse button is release the edges become harsh again.

Would be nice if the smoothing of edges (as during mouse click/hold) would stay on watermark.


Sounds like a known bug. I found another Topic just for this and i can copy that Problem. Hope for a fix soon.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby ppmax » Sun Aug 24, 2014 4:52 pm

I applied a watermark (overlay) and then decided I didn't want it anymore and removed it from the tool (using the Clear Overlay command).

However, the watermark still appears on every image in my catalog. If I use the Verify Catalog or Session... command the overlay no longer shows up...but then if I close and then open C1 again the overlay appears again.

Anyone know how to fix this issue?

thx
PP
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby NN635421662095046350UL » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:01 pm

I am an Aperture user and have been using Capture One for about a month as an alternative to the disappearing Apple software. I have tried LR as well and though it has some great features I don't like the workflow and I don't like the catalog system. While I find that Capture One does many things very well the biggest problem is the database. The database in Aperture is simple, easy to use and reliable. The database in Capture one doesn't make much sense to me (as messy and illogical as LR) and crashes continually. In fact it scares me. I really don't want to get hundreds of images in there and lose all my corrections or have to re-locate all my files every couple of days. I am tempted to go back to Aperture temporarily and wait and see what Apple comes up with to replace it.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby PhaseoneUser55657 » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:30 am

Ya, I am in the same boat. Though I have not had issues with CO7 for a while. At the beginning of 7.X series, the software was so buggy, that they should of canned the whole Development and Quality team for ever letting 7.0 out for public use. (I do software development full time, and if my team ever released software that bad, we would not of been doing software anymore, OK a Little RANT off).

I use the catalog in CO7, but do not store the files in the catalog but have them referenced. This way I have them both in Aperture and CO7.

Some Issues I have with CO7.

The biggest issues with CO7, is that if you do a round trip to another app you have have to re-import it back into CO7. How they ever came out with a Catalog system that is not capable of auto importing an export is beyond what I could ever imagine. I know they were coming from their session idea, and I tried it in version CO6, and it was so strange, never touch CO6 until CO7 came out, when I heard they had catalogs.

Another issue with CO7, is that they should drop back and let the OS handle Camera formats that they do not support. Even putting a badge on them, to signify it. It seems like that is what the do in MP, or so I believe.

I also wish they did not have you go through extra hoops to apply a setting to multiple images, I just don't get it. You select multiple images, change a setting, then either have to have remember to select the "edit multiple" or hold down the "shift" when doing the copy and apply, applies to menu items to. (I use the color labels when I have a shoot where there are different looks, to keep track.) Other wise it just applies what you did to the image you just adjusted, not any of the others. I understand the whole copy and apply, Copy from one, select another, then apply. But why not apply it to all if multiple items are selected, with out having to go through extra steps/key presses. I don't like the edit all because if I am just playing, I only want to screw around with one image, not all of them, until I get the setting how I like it.

I also think that Mac People, are doing to doing to much doom and gloom on the replacement of Aperture. I cannot believe they are not going to leave the adjustments as they are now. Look at it this way, are they going to make everyone go through and export all the images that they current have, to push out Tiffs/JPegs of their current adjustments. Even iPhoto uses the same Library format, and same non-destructive edits as Aperture. My guess is the new Photo.app will be Aperture just stuck in the Full screen mode, with the floating pallets.
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby SFA » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:57 am

PhaseoneUser55657 wrote:I also wish they did not have you go through extra hoops to apply a setting to multiple images, I just don't get it. You select multiple images, change a setting, then either have to have remember to select the "edit multiple" or hold down the "shift" when doing the copy and apply, applies to menu items to. (I use the color labels when I have a shoot where there are different looks, to keep track.) Other wise it just applies what you did to the image you just adjusted, not any of the others. I understand the whole copy and apply, Copy from one, select another, then apply. But why not apply it to all if multiple items are selected, with out having to go through extra steps/key presses. I don't like the edit all because if I am just playing, I only want to screw around with one image, not all of them, until I get the setting how I like it.


I think you just answered your own question there. It's surely why it works the way it does.

I feel for Mac users.

I'm reasonably sure that a lot of the development of most photo editing tools (not just C1) is the product of Mac based programming. But it seems to suffer from the Apple insistence that everything they do is right even if it is wrong.

To be fair Microsoft and their 3rd party tool development partners have been known to adopt exactly the same approach adding and removing functionality without making sure (or perhaps without caring whether) their development customers are told of the changes. It's not unheard of for Adobe to adopt the same approach.

It has been like that for years. It's really not something that end of the chain developers can control well especially those who need to operate at the leading edge of technical advances for some reason.

I'm a Windows user. I am fortunate in that because I can more readily control whether to take new releases of the Windows OS. I feel no need to rush into Windows 8 for example.

I missed the first few months of C1 V7 as I needed to upgrade my equipment to 64bit before I could run the application.

However since I installed C1 V7 I have had just one file corruption glitch (easily resolved once I had identified it and probably nothing to do with the application software). I have noted a couple of functional anomalies but nothing that cannot be dealt with.

I prefer sessions so have not done much with Catalogues.

I have not experienced the level of failure (or bugs) that seem to be the misfortune of Mac users. That surprises me in many ways but leaves me grateful that some other applications I need to use for non-photographic purposes are Windows only thereby making my choice for me.

Back a number of years ago the attitude to producing quality software had moved to satisfying all reasonable customer expectations with development tested to destruction and zero, or close to zero, bugs allowed before it could be released.

I worked for a team that, after several years of moving in that direction, went for the total success outcome during a product consolidation, platform expansion and new feature development project. We ignored requests to work with the latest technology as it moved ahead yet still the 1year project plan stretched to 2 years by the time testing was complete.

We had one known, documented and obscure bug left at the end of the project.

In that time the company passed into adminstration but continued trading and eventually was bought by another company before the project was completed. They stuck with the plan to completion.

To get such a well tested product out to the customers was a tremendous achievement and the customers that were still around after all the delays were impressed. But the market was moving on and the target businesses were breaking up or being taken over and the product, good as it was, slowly disappeared over the next 3 or 4 years.

I think only governments can realistically claim to be able to afford the endless developments and bottomless budget pots that would provide perfect software. Strangely they rarely seem to get any perfect systems running - presumably because by the time they have changed the specification many times along the way to keep up with changing needs the entire concept is obsolete by the time it is ready for use. That is despite their ability to specify strict requirements for hardware and OS configurations - something that is almost impossible to contemplate in the Photo Editing arena and many other specialist professional and consumer oriented markets.

Apple try to overcome that problem by controlling their "ecosystem". It seems that sometimes that fails.

Microsoft are less controlling in that area and one might conjecture that provides them with some expertise in seeking resilience with unknown configurations that Apple lack to some extent with their expectation of controlled and approved configurations. At certain stages of technological development and step changes on that path the MS approach might prove to be more resilient than the Apple approach - strange as that may seem.

Given that whilst many people seem to experience problems many others, using the same code, do not that would seem to suggest that problems may be environment specific rather than totally down to clearly avoidable development errors.

So to obtain 100% error free code it would have to be tested against the majority of possible system configurations on which the application might be installed - both historic and future, future being a particularly special challenge of course.

I don't think we could afford the cost of such a well tested application nor, probably, the wait for it to appear before the underlying technology became obsolete for purpose. And of course, as I have already pointed out, I see no significant problems with my installation so I and others in the same happy situation might wonder what would be the purpose of increased costs and waiting times.

It seems to me there are unlikely to be simply answers to how to deliver 100% error free code across multiple platforms - or indeed anything really close to that level.

Other opinions may vary, of course.



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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby NNN635461455459695134 » Fri Sep 12, 2014 6:11 pm

Any chance this 1/2 off discount will be coming back for aperture users? I've been trying Capture One Pro and although it;s taken me a bit to get used to it after so many years in Aperture, I have to say it's quite good! $300 is a bit steep for me, though at the moment :(
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Re: Aperture and Capture One

Postby SFA » Sat Sep 13, 2014 1:54 pm

NNN635461455459695134 wrote:Any chance this 1/2 off discount will be coming back for aperture users? I've been trying Capture One Pro and although it;s taken me a bit to get used to it after so many years in Aperture, I have to say it's quite good! $300 is a bit steep for me, though at the moment :(


Did you miss an extra smilie off that post?
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