Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

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Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby noah_mm » Sat May 10, 2014 12:36 am

Hi all.

I've just acquired this Phase One H101 back in Hasselblad H mount, and I need to test it ASAP in order to know whether I need to return it or not, but I have no camera. I intend to use this on a Fuji GX680 or maybe a mechanical camera (using lenses without shutters/sync cables), so I'll need to fire the back from software only.

I've connected it to a Mac via Firewire and used a cable release to fire two-shot mode. Initially I get a system error 7111, then it start working. A capture is retrieved to Capture One DB software, but the image is completely black.

Is this normal?

I thought the image would come out completely white since the sensor is completely exposed to light: the back is not mounted. I am only testing if it works.

Why is the image black? Is it taking a 0 time exposure since it's not mounted? How do I time the exposure from software, if that is even possible? What will I need to do to make sure it works as quickly as possible without having a camera? And if I mount it on FujiGX680 or any non-Hasselblad H camera, how does it know what shutter speed I'm using (i.e. how long to sense the light)?

Many thanks in advance.
Noah

Many thanks
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby Drew » Sat May 10, 2014 10:28 am

noah_mm wrote:
Is this normal?

I thought the image would come out completely white since the sensor is completely exposed to light: the back is not mounted. I am only testing if it works...

Why is the image black?



The image is black because you've exposed it to light for both halves of the capture Process. You mentioned that you're using it in Two Shot mode with a cable. That term right their should be the give away, Two Shots. One shot measured against another and resulting in the difference between the two.
To put it simply you have taken the fist shot fully exposing the chip, giving it a light value of 100%. The second shot, which is supposed to be the Black Calibration (black value measure) is also taken while fully exposing the chip, giving it too a value of 100%. So, when the back tries to create the image you've captured it does the basic equation of 100%-100%=0 and, rightly, 0 is completely black.

So, if you don't have a camera and you want to see if the back works…
Do a long exposure with the chip exposed (Press the wake up cable once to wake up the back, then press and HOLD to simulate a capture). Then, just before you let go of the wake up cable simulating a long exposure, cover the back and release the wake up button. The back will then perform the black calibration and measure a distinct difference between the exposed value of 100% and the black calibration of 0%. So, 100%-0% = 100% and you should have a white image with varying density depending on any shadows that were covering the chip.
Kind Regards,
Drew
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby noah_mm » Tue May 13, 2014 10:40 pm

Superb reply, thanks a lot Drew!

I did what you said and got a white image. This makes me think the sensor is working. So I put a lens in front of it, with some bellows to bar out light (but it was all handheld so lots of light leak) and got the following pictures. They are uploaded here in my dropbox.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/brgkpbctdsro ... wyXkThUE2a

You will see the first six or seven are black. Following three are white. Then I tried it with a handheld lens. However, there was some weird behaviour, the colour patters and the green/yellow tint were excessive and did not make any sense. Every capture was slightly different. Towards the second half of this group of shots, figures start to take shape because I started to get the hang of timing, but I only had two hands, and there was a back, bellows, a lens and a shutter release to control all at once. All parts were not attached to each other.

Don't judge, I was more limited than you can imagine. Needed to be on a Mac and the only one I had access to was at work during lunch time, so this was all chucked into my bag and taken to work. I couldn't do better at the time.

Do you think this back behaviour is normal? Can I rest assured my back is working?

I used to do this intentional light-leakage for a burnt-exposure/vintage look sometimes, but usually get a recognizable red tint and a lack of contrast. The patterns here were just plain weird.

I am thinking maybe because of how the two shot mode works? Something to do with timing the first and second shot and how long each of them has been? A technical explanation of how the two-shot mode works would be great.

Or if there is another way to take a shot in a one-shot mode. Can I fire it through the sync cable? What's the voltage tolerance there? OR can I link the regular shutter release plug to my Fuji GX680 Sync port, for instance?


Which brings me to the question of how one can control the length of exposure on this back when, say, using a sinar cam or a Fuji GX680 with mirror-up or anything similar? (I understand now why there needs to be a shutter, but is there a way to use it without one?)



Sorry for the blurp. If it sounds confusing I will summarize my questions in a clearer way.
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby Drew » Wed May 14, 2014 10:24 am

Not knowing your exact setup, the back seems to be capturing images and from that I would say it's working.

With regard to any clarification you may need for use, I would first suggest you reference the manuals and from their, should you still have any questions we can explore them.

The back ALWAYS works in a Two-Shot mode. However, on an actual camera body that the back is intended for, both actions will be fulfilled with one shutter press. If you intend to use the back on a camera in a manner like a "Pin-Hole" camera, you'll need to fake the Shutter signals manually just as you have him the tests performed.
Kind Regards,
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby noah_mm » Thu May 15, 2014 2:46 pm

Thanks again Drew.

Yeah you can say I was thinking of something like a pinhole setup with a lens. Basically: lens, bellow, back. No shutter (this will not always be the case as I'm preparing my Fuji GX680 to host this back). I first thought the back technology turns on and off the sensitive pixels for the required duration of the exposure, something like a mirrorless camera nowadays. Apparently not.

So that means the only way to control the exposure duration is a physical shutter, am I right?
Which also means there is a maximum amount of exposure time for which the sensor is always on, which is the 32 seconds that I've read about, right?
Or is it that the back will always shoot at a fixed speed long as it is not connected to a supported camera? (1/30s?)

OR will the back continue to exposure for white long as I'm pressing and holding the shutter release before it starts to calibrate for black?44 :shock::?:
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby noah_mm » Thu May 15, 2014 9:17 pm

Here's what I can say is my first image from that back. UNMOUNTED (just placed a lens and bellows in front of it and timed a shutter):

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/964 ... 026461.TIF

I thought that was supposed to be an 11MP image. Am I missing something?

And when I set the ISO to 400, I see lots of coloured pixels, red and green, in the fashion of dead pixels but I am reluctant to call them dead pixels because they are not as strongly lit on ISO 50.
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby Drew » Mon May 19, 2014 11:19 am

noah_mm wrote:I thought that was supposed to be an 11MP image. Am I missing something?


No, as the file you just provided is 11MB RAW file that can process to a 3992x2656px file (11MP rounded up).

noah_mm wrote:And when I set the ISO to 400, I see lots of coloured pixels, red and green, in the fashion of dead pixels but I am reluctant to call them dead pixels because they are not as strongly lit on ISO 50.

That's normal for a high ISO on this type of older technology.
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby noah_mm » Wed May 21, 2014 5:42 pm

Super, Drew. Many thanks.

I see now that Adobe Lightroom cannot process these RAWs and is only exporting the preview file out of them. I must process them only within Capture One it seems.

Which keeps asking me to enter license key. I thought Capture One DB was free for digital back owners?
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby Drew » Thu May 22, 2014 7:50 am

noah_mm wrote:Which keeps asking me to enter license key. I thought Capture One DB was free for digital back owners?


It is... but you have to run the software in DB mode :wink:
At the prompt to "Try, Activate or Run DB Mode" choose "Run DB Mode".
Kind Regards,
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby noah_mm » Fri Jun 13, 2014 12:19 am

There. Is. No. Such . Option.

Now the trial is expired and I cannot 'process' my RAWs. I still find no option to activate a free license for DB owner. The only options are to either activate online or activate manually. Both require product key.

I've donwloaded the installer from the Archive: Mac installers --> Capture One DB installers.

Should I have chosen another one? or should this installer be activated and process my RAWs?
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Re: Black image from unmounted Phase One H101

Postby Drew » Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:34 am

noah_mm wrote:There. Is. No. Such . Option.


Yes. There. Is. :wink:

Image

If you're using Capture One 3, you're welcome to create a support case with your Serial Number and we can give you a DB Key. However, Capture One 3 is not supported on current systems and current OS's.
Kind Regards,
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