Are previews working as intended?

Discussions, questions, comments and suggestions regarding Capture One PRO, Capture One PRO For Sony / Fujifilm, Capture One DB and Capture One Express For Sony / For Fujifilm 12.x for Mac

Are previews working as intended?

Postby Reign of Crows » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:45 am

Just to be clear, this post is about the image(s) that come up in the Viewer window when you select image(s) from the Browser.

When I import images I see Capture One indicating that it is building previews for an image count that perfectly matches the number of photos I have imported, as expected. However, the behavior is a bit odd. The first few images have thumbnails that have a shaded border in the Browser window, and clicking on these images loads... not instantly, but fairly brief. By comparison, there are quite a few images that do not have that shading around the thumbnail, and those take double or triple the time to fully load. (Bear in mind that I'm away from home for an extended period of time and have been using a MacBook connected to a larger 4K monitor as my main computer, so I'm hit with slowdowns more severely than I would be with my more powerful desktop.) It seems to me that only some images are either having previews truly built, or in use. Yet even if I use the "regenerate previews" option it doesn't seem to change anything.

Am I misunderstanding how previews should work, and what the shade-like outline signifies in the Browser window?

Any former Aperture users might be able to shed some light for me, too. I'm used to previews being something that allows for very fast viewing and limited zoom capabilities; I'd regularly toggle preview viewing on and off in Aperture, depending on how much fine detail I wanted to examine. I was hoping to do something similar in Capture One, but at this point I'm considering turning previews off altogether, because it seems like it needs to load each image from scratch almost every time so I'm just wasting space and some initial processing time on import.

Any thoughts, teachings, or advice? I greatly appreciate it. Still learning Capture One but have gotten comfortable enough that I'm glad I chose it, and really love the editing capabilities... just want to get a bit more out of it.
Reign of Crows
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:51 am

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby SFA » Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:16 am

Reign of Crows wrote:Just to be clear, this post is about the image(s) that come up in the Viewer window when you select image(s) from the Browser.

When I import images I see Capture One indicating that it is building previews for an image count that perfectly matches the number of photos I have imported, as expected. However, the behavior is a bit odd. The first few images have thumbnails that have a shaded border in the Browser window, and clicking on these images loads... not instantly, but fairly brief. By comparison, there are quite a few images that do not have that shading around the thumbnail, and those take double or triple the time to fully load. (Bear in mind that I'm away from home for an extended period of time and have been using a MacBook connected to a larger 4K monitor as my main computer, so I'm hit with slowdowns more severely than I would be with my more powerful desktop.) It seems to me that only some images are either having previews truly built, or in use. Yet even if I use the "regenerate previews" option it doesn't seem to change anything.

Am I misunderstanding how previews should work, and what the shade-like outline signifies in the Browser window?

Any former Aperture users might be able to shed some light for me, too. I'm used to previews being something that allows for very fast viewing and limited zoom capabilities; I'd regularly toggle preview viewing on and off in Aperture, depending on how much fine detail I wanted to examine. I was hoping to do something similar in Capture One, but at this point I'm considering turning previews off altogether, because it seems like it needs to load each image from scratch almost every time so I'm just wasting space and some initial processing time on import.

Any thoughts, teachings, or advice? I greatly appreciate it. Still learning Capture One but have gotten comfortable enough that I'm glad I chose it, and really love the editing capabilities... just want to get a bit more out of it.


Two thoughts based on your description

The shaded border on the thumbnails most likely represents parts of the image that have been cropped, either through automated lens correction or because they have been cropped as part of image processing.

As for the Previews - what size preview images are you creating for your 'norma'l size? (Edit > Preferences > Image > Preview Image Size)

The recommendation would be to work with Preview images that are the same resolution as your screen BUT, if you have set the Preview Image default size to be aligned with your 4k screen back home, that's s a lot of pixels to be manipulating and then a large Preview file that would need to be significantly reduced with pixels binned along the way for use with your smaller screened laptop. So C1 would need to re-calculate and reduce the number of pixels to be able to display the image.

Normally the previews would load to memory from disk and sit waiting to be used. However here are some significant overheads to not only copying the stored preview files and then re-calculating and re-sizing them for different hardware options with a potentially different size of screen but also several other factors that can add a little to both the recalculation effort and the revised screen size you will be expecting.


There is likely to be much more happening as well but absent a full and considered understanding of your work flow in detail I would only be speculating about how you do things. It would be better to understand in detail before taking up more of your time describing what might be hapening only to find it would not really apply to your work flow.

HTH.


Grant
SFA
 
Posts: 6239
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby Reign of Crows » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:18 pm

Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it. Good to know about the shading on the thumbnails.

Regarding the previews, I think it's set as the system default - when I look at my preferences, it's set to 2560. But my MacBook is connected to a 4K monitor, and I have the Viewer window set up on the 4K display, while the Browser window is on the MacBook's 12" "retina" display (set to the default, as well, so you're right that the working resolution is less than the preview size).

Usually when I click on an image to view it, it seems to load in three stages. The first image is pretty blocky; this is brief, I'd guess lasting less than a second. The second image appears soft, to the point that it's often impossible for me to tell if I missed focus. Capture One indicates that it's still working, and after 1-3 seconds the image sharpens up significantly (what I consider to be the third image). If I zoom in or make adjustments then there's additional processing time, but it doesn't feel quite as long as getting to that "third stage." (For what it's worth, on this computer Apple Photos also has a small delay between loading my exported JPEGs and showing the fully sharp, detailed version, but that delay is only about a second... granted, I know there's a difference between loading a RAW and a JPEG, but that's partly what makes me think that the previews aren't coming into play at all.)

As far as workflow goes, the reason this matters to me is primarily due to losing time when culling photos. I'm primarily looking at composition and focus errors, and if possible I'd like to stop losing those 1-3 seconds every time I click back to a photo. I do save time by viewing multiple similar photos at once, but I've trialed Photo Mechanic before and know that this could be a lot quicker; I'm just trying to avoid using multiple programs if I can get away with it.

I can certainly try increasing the size of the previews, or decreasing them... any other thoughts or tips are much appreciated, too!
Reign of Crows
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:51 am

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby NNN636798430406992977 » Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:25 pm

Reign of Crows wrote:I can certainly try increasing the size of the previews, or decreasing them... any other thoughts or tips are much appreciated, too!


Hi, I just posted this on a different topic but it may also be of help to you so I will repost here.

I found this article from 2017 that talks about the preview problem and gives a workaround.

https://blog.thomasfitzgeraldphotograph ... -around-it

Use “Proofing”. I did what the article suggests and on some photos the difference between the preview and an export (viewed through proofing) is alarming! I dread to think how many photos I have rejected unnecessarily.
NNN636798430406992977
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2018 6:17 am

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby SFA » Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:32 pm

NNN636798430406992977 wrote:
Reign of Crows wrote:I can certainly try increasing the size of the previews, or decreasing them... any other thoughts or tips are much appreciated, too!


Hi, I just posted this on a different topic but it may also be of help to you so I will repost here.

I found this article from 2017 that talks about the preview problem and gives a workaround.

https://blog.thomasfitzgeraldphotograph ... -around-it

Use “Proofing”. I did what the article suggests and on some photos the difference between the preview and an export (viewed through proofing) is alarming! I dread to think how many photos I have rejected unnecessarily.


I have glanced at that article and I suspect it is potentially misguiding.

There is no single answer to this, other than fudging something, if the number of pixels in a display does not match the number of pixels that will be output at 100% of whatever your chosen size might be AND the observer's eyes are able to utilise all of those pixels to pass details to their brain. And viewing distance matters too.

Since there are a number of different size screens around and not everyone uses the same size or even similar equipment there is no single problem and therefore no single answer for this subject. Which is probably why it always seems to be such a challenge.

Grant
SFA
 
Posts: 6239
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby SFA » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:11 pm

Reign of Crows wrote:Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it. Good to know about the shading on the thumbnails.

Regarding the previews, I think it's set as the system default - when I look at my preferences, it's set to 2560. But my MacBook is connected to a 4K monitor, and I have the Viewer window set up on the 4K display, while the Browser window is on the MacBook's 12" "retina" display (set to the default, as well, so you're right that the working resolution is less than the preview size).

Usually when I click on an image to view it, it seems to load in three stages. The first image is pretty blocky; this is brief, I'd guess lasting less than a second. The second image appears soft, to the point that it's often impossible for me to tell if I missed focus. Capture One indicates that it's still working, and after 1-3 seconds the image sharpens up significantly (what I consider to be the third image). If I zoom in or make adjustments then there's additional processing time, but it doesn't feel quite as long as getting to that "third stage." (For what it's worth, on this computer Apple Photos also has a small delay between loading my exported JPEGs and showing the fully sharp, detailed version, but that delay is only about a second... granted, I know there's a difference between loading a RAW and a JPEG, but that's partly what makes me think that the previews aren't coming into play at all.)

As far as workflow goes, the reason this matters to me is primarily due to losing time when culling photos. I'm primarily looking at composition and focus errors, and if possible I'd like to stop losing those 1-3 seconds every time I click back to a photo. I do save time by viewing multiple similar photos at once, but I've trialed Photo Mechanic before and know that this could be a lot quicker; I'm just trying to avoid using multiple programs if I can get away with it.

I can certainly try increasing the size of the previews, or decreasing them... any other thoughts or tips are much appreciated, too!


If you are running at 2560 but your 12" screen is less than that and your 4k screen is more then no matter which screen you are using the preview is no 'native' size and C1 will either have to recalculate to give you full value at and expanded 4k using more of the available pixels in the image file than it can at 2560 OR reprocess to a smaller size (assuming your 12" screen does not offer 2560 width resolution with comparable height resolution) and discard more pixels when initially viewing at smaller size.

I guess if you run both at the same time the machine has to try to do both at the same time.

As a test, can you run your 4k screen at 2560 resolution (or close to it) to see what happens with the Previews set at their existing value?

Unless you have an old camera source for files the chances are that you images will all be bigger, in pixel dimensions from the sensor, that even your 4k screen can support and thus display at 100% will exceed what the screen can support at native resolution.

You can also consider the Loupe view which can give a rapid view of a small part of an image from either the preview screen or the browser and offers options to adjust what it does to suit your preferences.

And then there is the Focus tool that offers an alternative way jump around an image checking focus as various levels of zoom.

There is also a Focus Mask warning feature that might be useful in the right circumstances but I think it is something that needs to be well understood in the context of the images one is shooting and reviewing.

Other may have further suggestions but these are the ones that coma to mind and offer some common approach no matter what the size of the pre-prepared preview files might be. Your choice on that may coma down to 3 things.

    Which screen size you work with most often.
    Which preview size offers the best option in terms of disk storage requirements and file loading to memory when working with C1.
    Which options give you the speed of response you really need - is checking sharpness the most important thing for speed or do you always feel a need to also get an impression of the what the whole image will look like at full 100% resolution? And are you doing all of that assessment before adding any adjustments at all or do you do common basic adjustments when you import the files?

There are other factors as well but it's probably not yet sensible to dice into them until you have made you decidion about whether the Previews are offering you what you need.


HTH.



Grant
SFA
 
Posts: 6239
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby Reign of Crows » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:41 am

NNN636798430406992977 wrote:Hi, I just posted this on a different topic but it may also be of help to you so I will repost here.

I found this article from 2017 that talks about the preview problem and gives a workaround.

https://blog.thomasfitzgeraldphotograph ... -around-it

Use “Proofing”. I did what the article suggests and on some photos the difference between the preview and an export (viewed through proofing) is alarming! I dread to think how many photos I have rejected unnecessarily.

Thanks for that. I did see your post before making mine, and it's something I might look into... but in my case images always render sharpness properly, it's just that it takes time to get there, as if the preview isn't being used at all. If I'm right that previews aren't being used, and if I can fix it, then I'll probably have to advance on to the solution you mentioned!

SFA wrote:If you are running at 2560 but your 12" screen is less than that and your 4k screen is more then no matter which screen you are using the preview is no 'native' size and C1 will either have to recalculate to give you full value at and expanded 4k using more of the available pixels in the image file than it can at 2560 OR reprocess to a smaller size (assuming your 12" screen does not offer 2560 width resolution with comparable height resolution) and discard more pixels when initially viewing at smaller size.

I wasn't sure what resolutions I was actually working with, but you raised an interesting point. The 12" screen is scaling down to 1280x800 while the 4K screen is scaling down to 1920x1080... in other words, the previews are larger than my display would be capable of. And of course, I'm not looking at the previews fullscreen, either; while the Browser window is maximized to the full screen, the preview is contained within the window, which has the toolbar and such.

I'll change the preview to be smaller, then, and will see if it makes a difference. If your theory is right, it is because the preview doesn't match the resolution of the display that the computer isn't scaling the preview down, but is instead recreating a preview? Or perhaps it is scaling the preview...

I hope that's the issue. If it is, I'll admit that I'd also be surprised that Capture One doesn't analyze the resolutions of the displays of the computer to determine what the preview size should be. 2560 is perfect for the 27" 5K iMac I run at home, I suppose, but this Capture One was set up fresh on the MacBook.

Addendum:
Well, I tested it, regenerated the previews, and... no difference in the behavior. I didn't use a timer but my perception was that the timing was about the same, as well; I only regenerated previews for some of the images from the same series, and jumping between images that would have had different preview sizes was the same.

Am I misunderstanding what the previews are supposed to be? Are they only used for the thumbnails in the Browser, or do they come into play for the Viewer as well? For fun, I put the Browser window on the larger monitor and made the images as large as possible in that window, and the softness that was alluded to was definitely apparent (and I can see how the focus mask would come into play there - a tool that I hadn't used before, so thanks for mentioning it). To really test that one I suppose I should set the preview size to the smallest it goes, regenerate a few that way, and then see if it looks different in the Browser.

I'm used to selecting images from the browser and doing those examinations on the Viewer, including viewing multiple at a time. It's a habit I picked up when using Aperture, and the previews displayed in Aperture's viewing window... but I'm wondering if Capture One does it differently and generates the Viewer's image from scratch each time. Are most people purely doing their analysis from within the Browser window, only using the Viewer for editing?
Reign of Crows
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:51 am

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby SFA » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:50 pm

The thumbnails are very small files intended only for browser use on any screen size. The idea is to be able to identify an image of interest rather than check quality, sharpness etc.

If you make the Browser window full screen and run the thumbnails at maximum enlargement they will be on the edge of whatever quality they offer. If you have a large sensor in the camera you cold have a raw file size of, say, 20 to 40Mb typically. Maybe more.

The thumbnails will likely be something like 20-40 kb. Maybe less. Clearly there will be a difference.

The Previews are intended to be sensibly sized files that can be retrieved from disk (to save constant regeneration at load time) and give a reasonable indication of quality and content and colour rendition, as set by the user, should one choose to do so, with a size related to the available resolution of the main monitor to be used.

Like the thumbnails the are generated and stored on disk ready to be brought into memory in preparation for viewing. As I understand it C1 pre-loads Preview files with the intention of try to be pre-prepared for the user's likely next actions. I guess how well that works depends on the way the user works!

Depending on Preview file resolution at the starting point the file display may need to be reduced in size to fit on the screen (reduced pixel dimension and therefore some 'binning' required from what is in the Preview version of the image) or expanded to 100% to see full detail most likely at a resolution that exceeds the available display pixel dimensions. (And probably the ability of one's eyesight to see all the detail.)

Changes are applied in memory when editing including calculation to use all the available pixels not just the screen sized subset when viewing at 100% (or greater).

If you are specifically looking to check details rather than overall effect then viewing at 100% is recommended since at that point one is using all of the image data available. However you will likely need to move the image around on the screen since even at 5k screen may well not have enough pixel presentation capacity to display an entire digital image from a recent camera.

The general consensus seem to be that for a preview size set to the native size of the viewing monitor zooming to 50% or a little more is likely to be necessary to pick out subtle colour details and similar. 100% for final assessment.

Of course in reality the final assessment needs to be done based on the required output size using a suitable recipe for the output medium to be used and Proofing applied with suitable sharpness deployed for the medium to be used (different for screen and print for example). And of course the viewing distance needs to be considered too.

You would not really want to be using the Thumbnails and the browser for assessing colour quality and sharpness - unless you use the Loupe tool or the Focus Tool at the same time.

Using the viewer allows up to 9 preview images to be displayed at the same time (small numbers are possible) and they can be browsed in "sets" of between 2 and 9 images. The Loupe and focus tools are also useful here for checking details quickly and zoom controls allow for more detailed checks on multiple images at the same time if required.

In all cases if you wish to see the finest details of focus or colour resolution you really need to view at 100%. Saving the Preview files at 100% will not be possible for all cameras nor really desirable for any cameras since the file sizes will be large and storage, internal file movements (disk to memory) and memory demands will all be somewhat compromised if attempting to work with large numbers of large preview files.

There is potentially much more to discover but I think this post is more then long enough for now. Also I must get on with some other tasks.


Grant
SFA
 
Posts: 6239
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby Reign of Crows » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:38 am

Grant, I appreciate the explanation. When it comes down to it, I'm under the impression that the previews really aren't being utilized at all, and the image is being regenerated every time. Does it sound like I'm way off? If not, is there any way to fix this?
Reign of Crows
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:51 am

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby SFA » Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:23 am

Reign of Crows wrote:Grant, I appreciate the explanation. When it comes down to it, I'm under the impression that the previews really aren't being utilized at all, and the image is being regenerated every time. Does it sound like I'm way off? If not, is there any way to fix this?


They are likely being regenerated in memory. That is normal during editing but not so desirable for initial viewing.

However you are working with screens of very different native resolution on the one hand but probably want to constrain the amount of disk space the Previews require on the other.

Which screen size do you use the most? I would set the preview resolution to fit with that screen (as per Phase recommendations) and see how that works for you. That would reduce disk storage if using the smaller screen, The larger screen will re-calculate anyway ... though why a 4k screen is using 1920x1080 is probably worth understanding. Is that a graphics driver setting?

If so set the preview size to that resolution and see what happens but bear in mind that a lot of disk activity ifs related to populating MEMORY with the files saved to disk to make the workflow faster, where possible, after loading.

I don't recall if you mentioned whether you are catalogues or sessions. I suspect a catalogue.

I use sessions and when I am travelling (not as extensively as you I suspect) I only expect to have currently active sessions with me. The number of images being carried around is greatly reduced compares to a full collection.

It happens that both my screens, laptop and external, are the same resolution so I would not consider using different size preview settings BUT it would be an option and logically one would work with the smaller size.

HOWEVER, if you use a catalog and perhaps the facility to make certain edits even if the original file is not available ... and you have the disk capacity to live with larger previews, then the more pixels in the preview the more satisfying off-line editing is likely to be. (You would have more data to work with.)

The previews will certainly be used if the resolution matches what the screen can display or the screen is smaller (but the preview will need to be re-processed to suit the lower resolution.

If, however, you want to see/edit the image as 100% (or greater) then the date in the preview would in most cases be far less than the original file would contain and so C1 will need to go to the original file and regenerate at full size with the adjustments recorded in the edit data. That carries an overhead much of which is not going to result in heavy processing but some things, by their nature, will result in a lot of calculation being required. The trade off to reduce that activity a little would be to have a much larger preview file. However in most cases a 100% view will mean the image dimensions are larger than a screen can display so "normal" screen size viewing will necessitate an in-line downsizing every time you load a file ...

Oh for the early days of digital photography when the files produced would mostly fit on the available screens at 100%!


Grant
SFA
 
Posts: 6239
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby Reign of Crows » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:50 am

Thanks again for the reply, Grant.

You are correct that I am using a catalog.

Working with a lower resolution than the maximum supported resolution is a function of macOS. My understanding is that most displays, if used at their true maximum resolution, result in incredibly small text and windows; by halving (I think?) the working resolution, you have text and windows that are much more legible but have the added benefit of appearing much sharper due to the true pixel density being greater. It's possible to override this and force the operating system to go 1:1 for the pixels, but everything appears incredibly tiny and there's not much practical benefit for doing so.

Unless I'm misreading something with my working resolutions, the C1 Previews should be a greater resolution... but simply resizing a preview would likely be faster than what I'm seeing. As an example, when I look at an image in Apple photos, there's often a second or two before the full sharpness becomes apparent... but there's still a decent image displayed before then. With Capture One, the initial image is rather blocky, then becomes a soft-appearing image, and then the full detail loads. That's what makes me think there's no preview being utilized at all.

I don't mind the idea that it would go to the original image and reload it when zooming in to 100% - I expect that, and find that preferable to being zoomed in on a preview. I'm just trying to load the images so that they are larger than a thumbnail, to assess for gross focus and composition errors.
Reign of Crows
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:51 am

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby SFA » Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:55 am

Reign of Crows wrote:Thanks again for the reply, Grant.

You are correct that I am using a catalog.

Working with a lower resolution than the maximum supported resolution is a function of macOS. My understanding is that most displays, if used at their true maximum resolution, result in incredibly small text and windows; by halving (I think?) the working resolution, you have text and windows that are much more legible but have the added benefit of appearing much sharper due to the true pixel density being greater. It's possible to override this and force the operating system to go 1:1 for the pixels, but everything appears incredibly tiny and there's not much practical benefit for doing so.

Unless I'm misreading something with my working resolutions, the C1 Previews should be a greater resolution... but simply resizing a preview would likely be faster than what I'm seeing. As an example, when I look at an image in Apple photos, there's often a second or two before the full sharpness becomes apparent... but there's still a decent image displayed before then. With Capture One, the initial image is rather blocky, then becomes a soft-appearing image, and then the full detail loads. That's what makes me think there's no preview being utilized at all.

I don't mind the idea that it would go to the original image and reload it when zooming in to 100% - I expect that, and find that preferable to being zoomed in on a preview. I'm just trying to load the images so that they are larger than a thumbnail, to assess for gross focus and composition errors.


Ah, OK. What I had not quite connected to before was that you have the 4k screen set to use 2k resolution.

But if I recall correctly you have the default Preview resolution set to 2560 pixels. So to fit the native screen resolution you are running will mean that all previews will need to be reduced in size by quite a significant amount.

As an experiment I would suggest changing the default Preview size to 1920 in the Preferences and regenerating the previews (for existing images) or simply run a test catalog and import some images to it after you have changed the setting and then see how that performs. You might also want to try 1680 and for a comparison given the lower resolution of the smaller screen. See what works best on balance. (As a Windows user I'm not familiar with Macs and I have no idea whether the screen handling methods are directly comparable so I don't think I could usefully run any meaningful comparisons on my system, And in any case I don't have a 4k screen to experiment with!)

If you are running C1 Pro you can have both catalogs open at the same time (via a setting in the Preferences) which would allow comparative testing side by side (though depending on your system's configuration that may introduce so performance constraints in absolute terms. However, side by side comparisons should still be valid.)

HTH.


Grant
SFA
 
Posts: 6239
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:32 pm

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby Reign of Crows » Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:11 pm

I set the preview size to be smaller and regenerated them, but the timing felt to be the same (I didn't use a stopwatch, but I don't think it's necessary for this). I think something might be broken with this. Again, even Apple Photos takes about a second (probably a bit less) to have the full sharpness show up when I look at a photo, but the first image doesn't appear blocky as if it's being generated from scratch each time, which is what's happening with Capture One. So I could believe that there's a delay in downscaling of a preview going on, but not like this - this makes it seem like there's no preview being accessed at all.

While it'd be surprising, I'm wondering if this is something that might not be broken on the Windows version but is on the Mac version. Any Mac users experiencing anything similar?
Reign of Crows
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:51 am

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby NN635680879799322049UL » Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:37 pm

Reign of Crows wrote:While it'd be surprising, I'm wondering if this is something that might not be broken on the Windows version but is on the Mac version. Any Mac users experiencing anything similar?


I have a pretty fast system (iMac Pro with 64GB RAM, Radeon Pro Vega 64, 2 TB SSD). My resolution is set as a compromise between the iMac and my MacBook Pro, but even if I set it to take advantage of the full 5K display on the iMac Pro, the timings are the virtually same. In brief, it takes a second or a bit more to display a preview at full sharpness. If you rapidly scroll from one image to another, you can see this, but if you dwell on an image for a second or so, Capture One appears to work in the background to load the next image so that it appears in full resolution. Sometimes it seems to load more than one image in the background. There are practical issues adjusting an image regardless of the selected resolution, such as the differences in the size of the image display window, and full screen versus a window, which is why I expect the selected resolution is more of a ballpark selection.

That said, for me the timings are OK, but much slower than in Aperture. This is also true for loading All Images. It takes my 58.5K image catalog about 10 seconds to load (much faster than older versions on an older Mac Pro). Even on the old Mac Pro, Aperture was much faster and All Images loaded quite fast, as did search results. The comparison may not be entirely fair, given I have doubled the size of the catalog with much larger image files since leaving Aperture. Still, I think Aperture had very snappy DAM, but the killer was it was nowhere near as good at RAW image processing.

Jerry C
NN635680879799322049UL
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Sun May 24, 2015 7:12 pm

Re: Are previews working as intended?

Postby NN635680879799322049UL » Sun Feb 24, 2019 6:13 am

One thing I forgot to consider and it will be obvious from my observations that I do not have a clue about how Capture One is engineered. But, I do have timing data for full resolution image display that I find confusing. Although the resolution of the image when the original is off line depends on the preview size, I am assuming the original is available and want to discuss the relevance of preview size and speed in that context.

I presume a preview does not incorporate adjustments given regenerating previews after making adjustments does not change the timing to display a full resolution image. It appears Capture One has to apply the adjustments when it displays an image and this takes time to calculate. This time will vary with the robustness of the computer and one would expect it to vary with the number and type of image adjustments and he preview file size selected in the preferences. I cannot find evidence for an effect from selecting large versus small preview sizes on my iMac Pro.

Regardless of the preview size preference or zoom setting, Capture One must resize the image according to the size of the window in which it is displayed. This would seem to be another factor regarding time to generate a full resolution image. No matter the preview size preference I choose (from smallest to largest), I cannot produce a change in the time for full resolution display. For me, window size and preview file size do not affect the time for full resolution display.

So, how important to speed of full resolution display is the selection of a preview size? Will a system with a fast processor, lots of RAM, fast graphics processor and a large SSD mask the effect of the preview size set in preferences?

In summary, no matter how I adjust the preview size preference, I cannot change the speed to display an image at full resolution. It is always between less than to just over 1 sec. Why? For me, it would seem that if I always have the original images available to my catalog, preview size is irrelevant. If so, why not just use the smallest preview size since the difference in preview file size is enormous (KB versus MB, each)?

Jerry C
NN635680879799322049UL
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Sun May 24, 2015 7:12 pm

Next

Return to Capture One 12.x Software for Mac



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest